並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep-24-%E8%A6%81%E6%88%90%E7%82%BA%E4%B8%80%E4%BD%8D%E9%AA%A8%E7%A7%91%E9%86%AB%E5%B8%AB-%E9%99%A4%E4%BA%86%E6%9C%83%E8%AE%80%E6%9B%B8%E9%82%84%E9%9C%80%E8%A6%81%E9%80%9A%E9%81%8E%E5%93%AA%E4%BA%9B%E9%97%9C%E5%8D%A1-feat-%E6%9E%97%E5%AE%97%E8%AB%AD%E9%86%AB%E5%B8%AB/id1527042453?i=1000559560201